What image do you have of classical music?
As a musician, I love classical music and I enjoy going to classical concerts. But as a teenager, I was always afraid of the image this could have among my friends. To them, I was part of a different world sometimes, an old-fashioned one. However, some of my non-music-lover friends went to concerts and completely changed their idea about this art.
Music has always been a big part of my life and I have wanted to discuss the promotion of classical music to young generations for a long time. I was lucky to have Pierre among my friends to chat about this subject.
Interview with Pierre Otzenberger (PO), in charge of audience development at Radio France* and former president of the Symphonic Student Orchestra of Lille
*Radio France is a French public service radio broadcaster; it counts seven national networks (and several regional stations). Moreover, the company has two orchestras and two choirs.
CF: Good morning Pierre and thank you for your time. To begin this interview I would like you to briefly introduce yourself and your work at Radio France.
PO: Hello! Well, I am in charge of the audience development at Radio France, as you said. I work in the music direction in order to develop the audience of the concerts in the “Maison de la Radio” (“House of the Radio”). This House gathers the radio stations and Radio France’s four musical ensembles: the Choir, the choir school called “La Maîtrise”, the Philharmonic Orchestra and the National Orchestra of France. Radio France’s ensembles are amongst the most famous ones in France and in Europe. More than 250 concerts take place every year in the “Maison de la Radio” or in the country. This means that we have to fill the venues as much as possible each time and try to seduce a younger audience. So that sums up my job, find new audiences, create events to invite them in the House so they can experience a live concert. Our offer extends from classical music to jazz but there are all the classical types: orchestra, choir, organ concert, contemporary music, chamber music, recital, opera, and so on.
CF: What strategies does Radio France have to attract more young people to its concerts?
PO: To develop our young audience we are a team of one, that is my job and unfortunately this is not my only mission. This is obviously not enough people to work quickly and extensively. I am in charge of bringing new ideas to the Direction. If my projects take shape, I am involved in their concrete realisations and I coordinate them.
To reach such an audience, which we called the under 28 years old, I channel my ideas on the concert experience. I use social media and give my priority to Instagram as much as possible. We also have some partnerships with student associations to expand our BtoC network; they represent a big opportunity to reach the public but also to reach what we call a bridging public. Then, we use co-branding operations and build partnerships with companies or media which directly speak to the younger generation such as Konbini or L’Etudiant. We really suffer from a lack of both image and knowledge from this particular audience because Radio France is a large 56-year-old public institution.
We also offer really attractive prices to enable all young people to buy a concert ticket cheaper than a movie ticket. All cultural institutions rely on this strategy because they all struggle with a lack of young attendance. People under 28 years old would rather pay for an expensive ticket for a pop concert, or for a 4D movie ticket with turning seats, than go to museums or concerts. It is not a generalisation but it’s what we really observe in reality.
Moreover, the French social development since the end of the 20th century generated (with the help of technologies) the development of amateur practices. Nowadays, people from all ages don’t want to be spectators anymore but want to take part in their own entertainment. In that sense, we constantly need to bring out new ideas with interactive content to involve the audience. This is an amazing development in the cultural domain, but this also reveals an underlying problem as we need to endlessly reconsider the concert format (live on Facebook, game-concert, programme chosen by the public, participative concert, etc.). The field of classical music is, for now, not as concerned, but soon we will need to find new formats and break away from the traditional practices established at the beginning of the 20th century.
CF: According to you, why is it important for Radio France to reach the young generations?
PO: It is really important to not misinterpret this. Purely from a marketing perspective, a young person doesn’t bring in any profit but it is an investment for the long run. The young audience which is attracted by classic concerts is rather small, but loyal.
On the other hand, there are two reasons for reaching this non-natural audience: the first one is philanthropic and egoistical with regard to classical music, we want a young person to open up and share our passion; the second reason is to develop the public above 40 years old.
CF: What do you mean?
PO: Take an average person who went to concerts during his youth thanks to discount prices. This person between 30 and 40 years old will have a job and kids and will move away from the venues because of a lack of time for his cultural activities. He will rather have a drink with friends instead of stay in a venue. In his forties of fifties this person might come back when he retires or when the children move out. This is exactly why you see so many grey heads in the concert venues. At a concert the majority of people are over 50 years old, some people under 30 and a few between 30 and 40. The average audience age of the Radio France’s concerts is 51 years old, which is not so much as we have an attendance rate of 90%.
CF: Ok that makes more sense now. Are you aware of other means or other examples to promote classical music in other institutions?
PO: We all use almost the same practices: discounted prices, children’s workshops, music initiation, family concerts, special concerts for under 28 years old, co-branding with brands that are popular amongst the youth. Our direct competitors (The Paris Opera or the Philarmonie de Paris) do the same things, except that the Philarmonie was renovated in 2015 and has now a more modern image and can offer easier concert formats thanks to its infrastructure. Young audiences constitute a financial niche so we cannot spend our entire budget to bring 2000 young people in a venue only once. We have to create less costly actions because a young person would never pay more than 10€ for a ticket. These sales normally represent only 2% of the production costs. That is why we try to be creative and find simple processes to be as efficient as we can every time.
CF: You have been part of numerous music associations, orchestras and various projects, what do you think classical music has brought to your own life? And is there also a benefit for those who don’t want to work in the music industry?
PO: Personally, music has been my passion since my childhood because of my upbringing (my parents were both singers and amateur musicians). I started playing music really young and was almost professional but decided to not doing it for a living. Playing an instrument gave me discipline and a particular state of mind; I can’t exactly describe it but a lot of musicians have it. When you chat with musicians, you understand each other better, it’s a feeling. Above all, playing in an orchestra, being part of an ensemble, is wonderful. It creates interactions and you learn to work as a part of a team. You learn to rely on others while staying focused; you learn to work on your own and then adopt a collective view. To me, the life of an orchestra sums up all the ideas of social life, and it is kind of an early training for living in a community. It is just really interesting!
CF: Yes, I could not agree with you more. So why do you think classical music suffers from an “old-fashioned” image?
PO: (laughing) Classical music is an old art, not “anti-modern” but it is literally centuries old. If I want to do a bit of history about cultural practices in France, there was actually a big gap at the end of the 19th century. Until the end of the 19th century, people were “living” the music; they were going to theatres or to the opera to see a performance (orchestra, soloist, choir, etc.). In 1877, the phonograph was invented and from there, people could listen to music at home, so why go outside?
Classical music has not been deeply renewed and has still today a very traditional style with precise codes. Because of that, people started to leave concert venues more and more. Nowadays we observe a radical change; venues are starting to be busier than during the early 2000s.
There is also another reason which is specific to classical music. At the beginning of the 20th century, composers wanted to bring out new ideas to reinvent formats and styles in classical music and they tried to use electronic devices to do so. They tried to incorporate electronics into instruments and pieces. This brought up “concrete” or “acousmatic” music and then “electronic” and “electroacoustic” music. These different styles had a huge influence on music in the whole century. Today music comes from this history: pop, rock, funk, RnB, rap… All these styles we listen to are a sort of extension to classical music (sometimes called “Art Music”) so there is no real dichotomy there.
CF: What do you want to say to our readers who have a lack of knowledge in classical music?
PO: There is no harm in not knowing something, the mistake would be to ignore it on purpose.
No one can know or be aware of everything, indeed there are some things that should remain a mystery. However, the best quality of a human being is its curiosity and its ability to not be offended or fall into complacency, because we should be able to find humanity in all arts and not only in things we like.
Finally, everyone has more knowledge in classical music than they think: cinema, advertisements and television have always used this musical genre to set particular atmospheres. Everyone knows this music without being actively aware of it or without being able to name it.
CF: Thank you so much Pierre for this very interesting conversation. I wish you all the best for your next projects.
PO: Thank you!
Post written by Clotilde F.
Music Meets Media 